- Jun 06, 2010 5 digit serial number is Manurhin mfg as they all were till mid 80s. Walther took over their own complete mfg'r of the model in about '86 and bumped their starting serial numbers to the 700,000 range (800,000 for the PPK).
- Manurhin pp serial numbers, manurhin walther manurhin pp serial numbers, walther pp. 22 serial numbers, walther pp 22 serial number, walther pp 22 serial numbers. Is for a post WW2 Walther. 380, PP or PPK of serial numbers for Walther PP s the year this Walther PP cal 9mm was made.
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I have always wanted a Walther PPK for my collection. The Walther PP-series pistols are of a simple blowback design and were extremely popular in Germany for many decades, both during the Third Reich and after the war. PP stands for 'Polizei Pistole' (Police Pistol) and PPK stands for 'Polizei Pistole Kurz' (Police Pistol Short) because it had a slightly shorter frame and barrel/slide for better concealability. The PPK model became famous when Ian Fleming made it the standard carry pistol of his character James Bond, immortalized in many books and movies.
However, in good condition these Walther pistols command a high price here in the U.S., as in enough to buy a new rifle instead. Browsing around the gun show today I saw what looked like a Walther PPK in great condition marked at $400. Wondering what the catch was I picked it up. Turns out it was a Manurhin PPK/S in 9mm Kurz, a.k.a. .380 ACP.
Doing a bit of research, I quickly found out that Manurhin is a French company that apparently manufactured PP and PPK model pistols under license for Walther. Originally Walther produced PP and PPK pistols in Zella-Mehlis, a town in Thuringia, East Germany. After World War II ended, this area was occupied by the Russians, and Walther moved the company to Ulm in West Germany. However, for several years, Germany was not allowed to produce weapons. As a result, Walther licensed the production of the PP series of pistols to the French company 'Manufacture de Machines du Haut-Rhin', or Manurhin for short. Manurhin produced these pistols into the 1980s before the license agreement ended. (Source)
Manurhin continued to produce PP-series pistols for Walther even when Germany was allowed to produce arms again. These pistols were sold both under the Manurhin and the Walther brand. There is a popular myth that the Manurhin branded pistols were identical to the Walther pistols, which is not quite the case. While Manurhin pre-produced the pistols and then shipped them to Germany, the slides were unmarked, soft, and in the white because you cannot rollmark a hardened slide. The Walther pistols were rollmarked in Germany, hardened, tested, and proofed by Germans. This was enough to qualify them as German-made and to be sold under the Walther brand. However, the French pistols were completed and proofed in France, and they were not allowed to bear the Walther brand. Also, due to the slightly different hardening process, the blue of the Walther slides is brighter and does not match the blue of the frame. This is not a criticism of the French manufactured pistols, though. Their quality control was also very good and the Manurhin pistols are of high quality as well. (Source)
Anyway, enough with the history lesson and back to the present. This particular pistol bears the following markings and characteristics:
Slide - left side:
MANURHIN - LICENSE WALTHER
Model PPK/S Cal. .380 ACP/9mm Kurz
Made in France
MANURHIN - LICENSE WALTHER
Model PPK/S Cal. .380 ACP/9mm Kurz
Made in France
Slide - right side:
MANURHIN INTERNATIONAL
ALEXANDRIA VIRGINIA
(Crown proof mark) 2669XX
MANURHIN INTERNATIONAL
ALEXANDRIA VIRGINIA
(Crown proof mark) 2669XX
Barrel - right side:
(Crown proof mark) ST. ETIENNE
(Crown proof mark) ST. ETIENNE
Frame - right side:
2669XXS
2669XXS
Grip panels: Manurhin logo
This tells us several things: The gun was manufactured under license from Walther by Manurhin in France. The PP-series pistols were manufactured in several calibers (.22LR, 6.35mm/.25 ACP, 7.65mm/.32 ACP, 9mm Kurz/.380 ACP, 9mm Ultra), and this one is in 9mm Kurz (German for Short) or .380 ACP. It was proofed in St. Etienne, France.
Note: I have not yet been able to find an approximate manufacturing date. I don't have access to Dieter Marshall's book. I would appreciate any information to narrow it down.
It is slightly different from the original PPK model as indicated by the /S after the model (PPK/S) and the S after the serial number on the frame. This model came into existence after the passing of the Gun Control Act of 1968. The original PPK model did not quite meet the silly new import requirements which included length, weight, and other 'sporting' features. To meet the requirement, Walther took the frame of the full-size PP model and combined it with the shortened slide and barrel of the PPK model, and the PPK/S model was born which met the import requirements. This gun was imported by Manurhin Internal in Alexandria Virginia.
Note: I am not quite clear yet on why it is marked 'Manurhin International' and not 'Interarms Alexandria Virginia', the company that imported and distributed, and later also manufactured Walther PP-series pistols. I would appreciate if anybody has some clarification on that.
This gun looked like it was in great shape just by looking at it in the display case. Examining it closer and disassembling it quickly showed that it was in excellent condition. There is a little bit of minor holster wear on the slide and on the safety/decocking lever. Other than that, the blue looks like new. The internals look just as good. There are hardly any wear marks, and the feed ramps are sparkling brightly. Same goes for the magazines; the blue shows almost no wear and the finish looks like new. This gun was apparently carried in a holster for a while but rarely shot and taken care of very well. It is generously oiled. The slide-to-frame fit is excellent with hardly any play. The bore looks pristine. The recoil spring is stiff. All the parts move very smoothly. The pistol just has that feel of a high-quality well-made European pistol. The double-action trigger is heavy but consistent and smooth. The single-action trigger break is nice and crisp.
After some chatting, I haggled the price down to $370. I probably could have pushed harder, but the seller was a nice guy, it was cash and carry, and the pistol was worth it to me. I got a like-new Walther PPK for a quarter of what a Walther-branded pistol in worse condition probably would have cost me.
Since this is a caliber that I did not yet have in my collection, I picked up a few boxes of Fiocchi 9mm Kurz on my way out so I can go shoot it.
So, that was the story of my interesting impulse purchase at the gun show today. Hope you enjoyed it as much as I did. Any additional information or corrections are appreciated.
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CRUFFLER.COM
presents
HISTORICFIREARM OF THE MONTH,
March2000:
March2000:
Image credit: The Unofficial Walther Homepage http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/2188/pp.jpg | Type: Double Action Self Loading Pistol System of Operation: Blowback Caliber: 5.25mm (.22 LR), 6.35mm Browning (.25 ACP) 7.65mm Browning (.32 ACP), 9mmBrowning Short (.380 ACP) Capacity: Detachable box magazine, 8 rounds in 7.65mm Sights: U-notchrear, Blade front Length: 6.81' Weight (unloaded):24 ounces Barrel: 3.87' |
The WaltherPP pistol has a long and distinguished history that can be traced backto the earliest days of gunsmithing. In this article we will tracethe history of the PP, and, by association that of Waffenfabrik Walther,from its earliest beginnings to the latter part of the twentieth century.
The stateof Thuringen, in the eastern portion of Germany has long been home to oneof the great gunmaking centers of the world. In 1592 the gunsmithsof the area around Thuringa forest formed a gunsmith's guild. Theguild was incorporated in the town of Zella St. Blasii. 294 yearslater, in 1886, a twenty-six year old engineer named Carl Walther beganoperating a small gun shop, Waffenfabrik Walther, in Zella St. Blasii. Walther's first products were shotguns, hunting rifles, and small pocketpistols. As Waffenfabrik Walther became more successful, it expandedboth in size and in scope, producing such diverse items as office machineryin addition to firearms. However, it was not until 1908 that Walthermarketed his first successful self loading pistol.
EARLYPISTOL PATTERNSWalther Model 1 Image Credit: Rankin, James L., Walther Volume III, 1908-1980,(Coral Gables, Florida, 1981) Page 20 | Thisfirst pistol was called the Model 1 (or alternatively the Model 1908),and was a small, blowback operated, pocket pistol chambered for 6.35mmBrowning. The top part of the slide is cut away so as to expose thebarrel from the muzzle to the breech, and an internal hammer and recoilspring are located below the barrel. The Model 1's safety was ofthe cross bolt push type located on the rear frame. The Model 1 wasapproximately 4.375' long and weighs 12.8 ounces. Magazine capacitywas six rounds. |
thebarrel, and ends in a knurled barrel bushing. The knurled bushingserves as both a take down latch and the mechanism by which the recoilspring is retained in the slide. This model dispensed with the earliercrossbolt safety in favor of a lever located on the left side of the frame. One of the more interesting features of the Model 2 was the cocking indicator;unless there is a cartridge in the pistol's chamber, the rear sight isretracted into the slide. The Model 2 was 4.25' long and weighed9.75 ounces. | Walther Model 2 Image Credit: Rankin, James L., Walther Volume III, 1908-1980,(Coral Gables, Florida, 1981) Page 27 |
Walther Model 3 Image Credit: Rankin, James L., Walther Volume III, 1908-1980,(Coral Gables, Florida, 1981) Page 29 | demonstrateda significant improvement in workmanship over the earlier guns. Ason the Model 2 the slide encloses the barrel and ends in a dual purposebarrel bushing. The safety lever is located on the left rear of theframe. The Model 3 had no sights, but did have a sighting groovemilled into the top of the slide. Rare among Walther pistols,the ejection port on the Model 3 is located on the left side of the slide. Length was about 5', and weight was 16.5 ounces. Magazine capacitywas six rounds. |
commercialsuccess, and many were used by police agencies as well as the German militaryduring World War One. The pistol has an elongated barrel bushingwhich serves the same purpose as that on the earlier pistols, but in addition,also carries the front sight. Model 4's were manufactured between1910 and 1918. The Model 4 was 6' long and weighed about 18.5 ounces. Magazine capacity was eight rounds. | Walther Model 4 Image Credit: Rankin, James L., Walther Volume III, 1908-1980,(Coral Gables, Florida, 1981) Page 35 |
Walther Model 5 Image Credit: Rankin, James L., Walther Volume III, 1908-1980,(Coral Gables, Florida, 1981) Page 41 | theearlier guns, the Model 5 was blowback operated, with an enclosed slideand a knurled barrel bushing that served as both takedown latch and recoilspring retaining nut. Earlier versions of the Model 5 had no sights,just a sight groove milled into the top of the slide, while later versionshad fixed front and rear sights. The Model 5 was approximately 4.25'long and weighed 9.5 ounces. Magazine capacity was eight rounds. |
Parabellum, and was the first Walther pistol in this chambering. Mechanically, the Model 6 was no different than the Model 4, being a straightblowback pistol with a concealed hammer. As on the Model 4, the dualpurpose barrel bushing also provided a base for the front sight. The Model 6 is comparatively rare, having been manufactured for only twoyears. The Model 6 was approximately 8.25' long, and weighed 34 ounces. Magazine capacity was eight rounds. | Walther Model 6 Image Credit: Rankin, James L., Walther Volume III, 1908-1980,(Coral Gables, Florida, 1981) Page 44 |
Walther Model 7 Image Credit: Rankin, James L., Walther Volume III, 1908-1980,(Coral Gables, Florida, 1981) Page 47 | waschambered for the 6.35mm Browning. The Model 7 was essentially asmaller version of the Model 6. Despite being scaled down, this wasstill the largest 6.35mm Walther pistol to date. One of the Model7's primary users was the German military, with many officers carryingit as a substitute standard sidearm during the First World War. TheModel 7 was approximately 5.67' long and weighed 12 ounces. Magazinecapacity was eight rounds. |
recoilspring as well, dispensing with the barrel bushing. Disassembly wasaccomplished via the now familiar method of pulling the hinged triggerguard down while pulling the slide to the rear and up. There waseven a variant was offered with an aluminum alloy frame. The Model8 was a great commercial success, with some 500,000 being produced by theend of the Second World War. The Model 8 was approximately 5' inlength, and weighed 12.5 ounces. Magazine capacity was eight rounds. | Walther Model 8 Image Credit: Rankin, James L., Walther Volume III, 1908-1980,(Coral Gables, Florida, 1981) Page 49 |
Walther Model 9 Image Credit: Rankin, James L., Walther Volume III, 1908-1980,(Coral Gables, Florida, 1981) Page 55 | TheModel 9, a small blowback pocket pistol chambered for the 6.35mm Browning, was essentially an updated version of the Walther Model 1. As inthe Model 1, the top of the slide is cut away to expose the full lengthof the barrel. The Model 9 had an cocking indicator pin that protrudesfrom the rear of the slide when the gun is cocked. The Model 9 wasapproximately 4' long and weighed 9 ounces. Magazine capacity was6 rounds. |
POLIZEIPISTOLE - THE WALTHER PP
Theyears between the introduction of the Walther Model 9, in 1921, and 1929were a period of relative calm in the handgun industry. Older modelswere refined, and true innovation was limited. There were few newmodels introduced, and those that were generally followed established norms. In 1929, Walther introduced a new pistol which would take the world bystorm, and which, to this day, influences pistol design. Thenew pistol was called the 'Polizei Pistole,' or 'Police Pistol,' commonlyreferred to as the 'PP.' (The PP's law enforcement designation wasa comment on the safety with which it could be carried with a round inthe chamber - the idea being that police officers were the group most likelyto need the rapid first shot.)
Theyears between the introduction of the Walther Model 9, in 1921, and 1929were a period of relative calm in the handgun industry. Older modelswere refined, and true innovation was limited. There were few newmodels introduced, and those that were generally followed established norms. In 1929, Walther introduced a new pistol which would take the world bystorm, and which, to this day, influences pistol design. Thenew pistol was called the 'Polizei Pistole,' or 'Police Pistol,' commonlyreferred to as the 'PP.' (The PP's law enforcement designation wasa comment on the safety with which it could be carried with a round inthe chamber - the idea being that police officers were the group most likelyto need the rapid first shot.)
WALTHERPP FUNCTIONAL CHARACTERISTICS
ThePP was the first successful double action self loading pistol. Thedouble action mechanism meant that the pistol could be safely carried witha round in the chamber, ready to fire. The trigger pull on the first shotwould be a longer heavier pull (not unlike that of a double action revolver)than subsequent shots. After the first shot, the reciprocation of the slidewould cock the hammer for follow up shots if necessary. Overnight,the PP made all other concealable pistols virtually obsolete. Likethe other Walther pistols, the PP was blowback operated, and a magazineactuated slide stop caused the slide to remain to the rear after the lastshot had been fired. The pistol's mechanism includes a disconnectorwhich prevents more than one shot from being fired with each pull of thetrigger (although there were experimental models that had selector switchesto enable fully automatic fire.
ThePP was the first successful double action self loading pistol. Thedouble action mechanism meant that the pistol could be safely carried witha round in the chamber, ready to fire. The trigger pull on the first shotwould be a longer heavier pull (not unlike that of a double action revolver)than subsequent shots. After the first shot, the reciprocation of the slidewould cock the hammer for follow up shots if necessary. Overnight,the PP made all other concealable pistols virtually obsolete. Likethe other Walther pistols, the PP was blowback operated, and a magazineactuated slide stop caused the slide to remain to the rear after the lastshot had been fired. The pistol's mechanism includes a disconnectorwhich prevents more than one shot from being fired with each pull of thetrigger (although there were experimental models that had selector switchesto enable fully automatic fire.
A cartridgeindicator pin is found on most PP's, with the exception of those modelschambered for the 5.25mm (.22 LR) cartridge. The indicator lies ina tunnel bored in the slide above and parallel to that for the firing pin. When there is a cartridge in the chamber, the rear of the case impingeson the pin and forces it to the rear, where it protrudes from the backof the slide, indicating to the shooter that there is indeed a round inthe chamber. The cartridge indicator was a factory option, thus explainingearly PP's found without it. By the end of the Second World War,and in the interests of production rapidity, the cartridge indicator wasgenerally omitted.
Almostall PP's have fixed sights, a blade front and a u-notch rear. Therear sight is drift adjustable for windage. Most PP's have a pushbutton magazine release catch located on the left side of the frame behindthe trigger. However, there are some in 7.65mm and 9mm Browning Shortthat have a heel-clip magazine release located at the base of the frameat the rear of the magazine well.
The safetylever is located on the left side of the slide in that portion of the slidemilled with cocking serrations. When the safety lever is pointingforward, the pistol is ready to fire. When it is pointed downwards,the pistol is on safe. Some models of the PP (notably those madeearly in the production run) have a lever that rotates through ninety degreesto the safe position, but most safety levers rotate through sixty degrees. When the safety is applied, the sear is locked, the trigger and hammercannot be moved through much, if any, of their range of motion, and thesafety's spindle rotates such that it blocks the hammer from striking thefiring pin.Ifthe hammer is in the cocked position and the safety is applied, the hammeris automatically dropped onto the safety spindle, which prevents firing. The trigger is not returned to the forward position until the safety isplaced in the fire position. FINISHES Between1929 and the early part of the Second World War, PP's were extremely | Manyrefer to the safety on the Walther PP as a 'hammer drop,' and are contentto simply thumb the safety and let the hammer fall. The overwhelmingmajority of the time, this leads to no perceivable ill result. Thatis to say, the pistol doesn't inadvertently fire. The problem tothis approach is that every time the hammer falls, it falls on a rigidlyheld piece of metal. Eventually, the rigidly held piece of metal,the safety spindle in this case, will succumb to the battering, and crackand break. There is no way to observe this from the outside. This can lead to accidental discharge, injury or death. SO. . . .when you use the safety to lower the hammer on a PP or a PP clone, yourbest bet is to ease the hammer down. |
MARKINGS
Theserial number was generally located on the right side of the frame behindthe trigger, parallel with the angle of the grip. Some PP's havea second serial number on the right side of the slide, forward of the ejectionport. Additionally some pistols were shipped with two magazines serialnumbered to the gun.
Waltherfactory markings were generally found on the left side of the slide. They consisted of:Theserial number was generally located on the right side of the frame behindthe trigger, parallel with the angle of the grip. Some PP's havea second serial number on the right side of the slide, forward of the ejectionport. Additionally some pistols were shipped with two magazines serialnumbered to the gun.
Walther'sPatent Cal 7,65m/m Mod PP |
Free Serial Numbers
Pre-1945PP's bore one of two sets of proof marks. The first were the proofmarks in use in Germany between April, 1893 and April, 1940. Theseconsisted of a crown over the letter N (for Nitro or smokeless powder). These markings can be found on the right side of the slide below the ejectionport, the right side of the frame above the trigger, on the chamber face,and on the right side of the barrel near the muzzle. The other proofmarks were the Nazi commercial proofs, put into effect in April, 1940 untilthe end of the war. These consisted of a Nazi Eagle over an N, andwill be found in the same locations as the earlier proof marks.
For thoseguns seeing Nazi military service, acceptance stamps ('Waffenamt Stempeln')are found on the left side of the frame to the rear of the trigger andon the left side of the slide to the front of the cocking serrations. For those guns seeing police service, the police acceptance marking isfound either on the left side of the frame to the rear of the trigger oron the right front trigger guard webbing.
POST-WARPP'SManurhin Pp 7.65mm
Afterthe war, the Walther factory in Zella-Mehlis was in the newly formed EastGermany, and most of the machinery was taken away to the east by the occupyingSoviet forces. Carl Walther's heir, Fritz was lucky to escape tothe west. Through shrewd legal maneuvering, Fritz Walther was ableto maintain the pre-war patents to the PP, and its smaller brother thePPK. Anxious to build up the necessary capital to open a new Waltherplant, Fritz Walther entered into contracts with various firms outsideof Germany to produce the Walther pistols. One of the most successfulof these commercial collaborations was with Manufacture de Machines duHaut-Rhin, located at Mulhouse, France, which went by the trade name Manurhin. In the early 1950's, the Manurhin factory began to manufacture WaltherPP's and PPK's. These pistols were identical in every way, to includethe high standard of finish, to the pre-war Walthers. The only exceptionswere the markings on the grips and the slide. Slide markings on ManurhinWalthers are as follows:DU HAUT-RHIN MOD.PP Cal 7,65mm Madein France |
Productionof the Walther PP continues to this day.
BIBLIOGRAPHY
Rankin,James L., Walther Models PP and PPK, 1929 - 1945, (Coral Gables,Florida: 1994)
Rankin,James L., Walther Volume III, (Coral Gables, Florida: 1981)
WaltherModels PP and PPK is available from IDSA Books. Click on theimage to order:
Manurhin Pp Serial Numbers Dates
WaltherVolume III is available from IDSA Books. Click on the image toorder: